WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby turkeyman » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:58 pm

Ack. The most positive comment I heard after Maine got smashed by DII Stonehill was, "We are just babies. We have so many freshmen and sophomores. They were all seniors." Not quite true, of course, but close.

Still, it was a terrible outing. Clearly, there is a lot of work to be done in the next 12 days. And after.

It looked like virtually no one knew the sets. Players did not move well without the ball, passed the ball and then stood still when you expected them to cut toward the basket or toward a corner and another player to come out to the ball. I can't say the defense was bad. I didn't see much. Not in white suits.

Stonehill is no slouch, but it went 12-14 in DII last year and it was basically the same team we saw last year, when Stonehill stayed with Maine for 25 minutes before the talent gap widened and Maine won going away.

Hard to say there were many high points, but here are three. Dor Saar is both fast and quick. Also short. When she elevated yesterday for her jump shot, the top of her head was about level with the top of the head of her defender. She was guarding a taller player much of the day. The roster says she is 5-6, but when she stands next to Maddy McVicar, listed at 5-4, they appearr close to the same height, with Maddy perhaps a hair taller. Saar was at the point and probably hasn't learned the plays yet. For whatever reason, the team did not seem to respond to her at point.

Fanny Wadling looked to be ready to pick up where she left off last year. She got blocked a time or two early when she pivoted into her defender to shoot. She quickly returned to form, though, putting her body between the defender and the ball. She is going to be a bigger factor this year than last.

Maeve Carroll didn't get a lot of PT, but I liked some of what I saw. She reached over a player who had position on her to grab a rebound without fouling. She seemed to be in position, but the entry passes seldom came to her. Her timing and positioning for the rebound were good when shots went up. My basic question remains. At 5-10 can she play the four at this level or will she need to learn a new position, likely the three?

The team seemed unready mentally. Reminded me of the WNIT game at Quinnipiac in 2016 (Q waltzed, 90-44) after Maine had lost to Albany by one for the AEC title. That loss probably destroyed any will to play for the Maine kids. Several Black Bears seemed just to be going through the motions yesterday. No cohesiveness, no fire in the belly.

The team is both young and unaccustomed to playing with one another. Last year, with a truckload of freshmen, Maine did at least have some combinations that had played together. The two Croatians had been teammates a few times. Two of the Spaniards had been on the national U19 team together and had played in the European 3-on-3 tournament at the start of the season. And last year they had a grandmother in Sigi. There is no one on this team who can lead from the perspective of "been there, done that" as Sigi could. Someone has to step us to become that leader.

It will be interesting to see how well this team can gel in time for the opener against Tulane on Nov. 10.

Bob Neal
New Sharon
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby imposter » Sun Oct 29, 2017 4:25 pm

turkeyman:
Can you evaluate the coaching staff?
Maine Women have lost 2 D1 head coaches (Barron, Steelman) in the last 18 months.
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:03 pm

turkeyman wrote:Ack. The most positive comment I heard after Maine got smashed by DII Stonehill was, "We are just babies. We have so many freshmen and sophomores. They were all seniors." Not quite true, of course, but close.

Still, it was a terrible outing. Clearly, there is a lot of work to be done in the next 12 days. And after.

It looked like virtually no one knew the sets. Players did not move well without the ball, passed the ball and then stood still when you expected them to cut toward the basket or toward a corner and another player to come out to the ball. I can't say the defense was bad. I didn't see much. Not in white suits.

Stonehill is no slouch, but it went 12-14 in DII last year and it was basically the same team we saw last year, when Stonehill stayed with Maine for 25 minutes before the talent gap widened and Maine won going away.

Hard to say there were many high points, but here are three. Dor Saar is both fast and quick. Also short. When she elevated yesterday for her jump shot, the top of her head was about level with the top of the head of her defender. She was guarding a taller player much of the day. The roster says she is 5-6, but when she stands next to Maddy McVicar, listed at 5-4, they appearr close to the same height, with Maddy perhaps a hair taller. Saar was at the point and probably hasn't learned the plays yet. For whatever reason, the team did not seem to respond to her at point.

Fanny Wadling looked to be ready to pick up where she left off last year. She got blocked a time or two early when she pivoted into her defender to shoot. She quickly returned to form, though, putting her body between the defender and the ball. She is going to be a bigger factor this year than last.

Maeve Carroll didn't get a lot of PT, but I liked some of what I saw. She reached over a player who had position on her to grab a rebound without fouling. She seemed to be in position, but the entry passes seldom came to her. Her timing and positioning for the rebound were good when shots went up. My basic question remains. At 5-10 can she play the four at this level or will she need to learn a new position, likely the three?

The team seemed unready mentally. Reminded me of the WNIT game at Quinnipiac in 2016 (Q waltzed, 90-44) after Maine had lost to Albany by one for the AEC title. That loss probably destroyed any will to play for the Maine kids. Several Black Bears seemed just to be going through the motions yesterday. No cohesiveness, no fire in the belly.

The team is both young and unaccustomed to playing with one another. Last year, with a truckload of freshmen, Maine did at least have some combinations that had played together. The two Croatians had been teammates a few times. Two of the Spaniards had been on the national U19 team together and had played in the European 3-on-3 tournament at the start of the season. And last year they had a grandmother in Sigi. There is no one on this team who can lead from the perspective of "been there, done that" as Sigi could. Someone has to step us to become that leader.

It will be interesting to see how well this team can gel in time for the opener against Tulane on Nov. 10.

Bob Neal
New Sharon


Bob: Another insightful. informative, timely and interesting post.

Agree with most of your posts, especially that they have no Sigi to hold things together and it doesn't look like they will be able to develop one either with the current roster.

The only problem for Saar is if the opponents post her up on the block would force Maine to Zones.

Disappointed that Williams only got 8 minutes and Barra only 2 minutes. They are the two biggest players height wise on the roster. Wadling is 6'1", Johnson 6'2" and Millan 6'1" and that is it for 6 footers plus.

Williams in 8 minutes had 5 points, 1 rebound, 1 turnover and 1 assist.

Saar had 8 points, 5 rebounds, 1 assist and 1 turnover in 33 minutes.

Fogarty didn't score, 0 assists, 0 turnovers and 1 rebound in 15 minutes.

Carrol didn't score had 2 assists and 3 assists in 10 minutes

Williams had 5 points, 1 assist, 1 rebound, and 1 turnover in 8 minutes

Barra had 1 rebound didn't score in 2 minutes.

The 5 newcomers played 68 minutes out a possible 200. and scored just 13 of the 49 points. The returnees played 132 minutes and scored 36 points.

Last year Maine beat Stonehill 74-54 with this 68-49 loss that is a 39 point swing from a 20 point wing versus a 19 point loss on the same court at the same time of the season.

Thought biggest negative of the day for UMaine women was the head coach spending too much time arguing with the officials throughout the game. Her team needed her help much more than the officials did. Probably just frustration with the way the game was going.
BUT
Coaches at any level can't coach and referee at the same time without it effecting their coaching and their players.

Will be interesting to see the adjustments that are made coaching wise for the tip-off tournament at the "Memorial Gym "PIT" on November 10th and 11th.
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby mainejeff » Sun Oct 29, 2017 7:59 pm

This is going to be a rough season. WTF on the 2 new bigs getting no PT??? :roll: Poor Vachon is in over her head. :|
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby MaineBBFan99 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:13 pm

... And cue the oh so predictable overreaction after one game from the MBR faithful. After last year's dominating Purdue performance, it seemed that this board had all but proclaimed this team the AE champs. Let's take a step back before extrapolating one poor performance to how the team will perform the rest of the season.
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:29 pm

mainejeff wrote:This is going to be a rough season. WTF on the 2 new bigs getting no PT??? :roll: Poor Vachon is in over her head. :|


mainejeff: I agree on why didn't the 2 new freshmen bigs get more than 8 minutes for the women and 2 minutes for the men.

Sigi got the women by last year and this year there is no Sigi, She was like having a coach on the floor.
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:30 pm

mainejeff wrote:This is going to be a rough season. WTF on the 2 new bigs getting no PT??? :roll: Poor Vachon is in over her head. :|


mainebbfan99: Of course one game a season does not make. But when you get beat on your home court by a D-2 school by almost 20 and you beat them last year on your home court by 20 there is some room for concern especially with no Sigi Koizar on the floor.

Last year I picked them to get to the conference tournament final after their first game against Stonehill.

If they don't develop their two new freshmen bigs and give them playing time (Williams 6'5" and Barra 6'3") the AE pre-season women's coaches poll picking them for 6th is legitimate and it will be one and done come tournament time.

Maybe the other 8 head women's coaches in AE know more than we do.

I still believe the 5 new players are as good or better potentially then the 5 they lost via transfer, BUT THERE IS NO SIGI AND THAT WILL BE THE DIFFERENCE THIS COMING SEASON.

To be competitive they have got to use their size and with just a 6'5" frosh, a 6'3" frosh, a 6'2" senior and 2 6'1" 2 sophs.

They have got to be used and used properly or it will be a long season WITHOUT SIGI TO RUN THE SHOW AND TO BE THE COACH AND LEADER ON THE FLOOR..

JMO
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby MaineBBFan99 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:56 pm

If they don't develop their two new freshmen bigs and give them playing time (Williams 6'5" and Barra 6'3") the AE pre-season women's coaches poll picking them for 6th is legitimate and it will be one and done come tournament time.


So, give me some concrete numbers... how many minutes per game should the following bigs receive: Wadling, Johnson, Williams, and Barra?
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 9:38 pm

MaineBBFan99 wrote:
If they don't develop their two new freshmen bigs and give them playing time (Williams 6'5" and Barra 6'3") the AE pre-season women's coaches poll picking them for 6th is legitimate and it will be one and done come tournament time.


So, give me some concrete numbers... how many minutes per game should the following bigs receive: Wadling, Johnson, Williams, and Barra?


6'1' Wadling 30 minutes, and 6'5" Williams 30 minutes and 6'3" Johnson as needed for Wadling or Williams rest or foul trouble.

6'3" Barra is not a back to the basket post player she is listed as a guard on the roster as is 6'1 Millan. But Barra should get 15-20 minutes.

The roster has 9 guards and 1 center Williams and 3 Forwards, Wadling, Johnson and Carrol.
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Re: WBB: Maine 49 vs Stonehill 68 10/28 ..

Postby Linguist » Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:05 am

Okay, let's not blow this out of proportion.

It is just an exhibition game, and remember there are language barriers on the team, and chemistry issues with the roster turnover.

Yes there were negatives, no one played defense with their feet every single player reached and committed fouls. Defensively they were lazy and didn't really box out well. The effort wasn't there. Maybe I was expecting too much from Fogerty, but if she is the best high school shooter in Mass, there weren't many high school shooters to choose from, her release is awkward and slow, and she didn't hit a shot. Maybe it was nerves.

But there were positives, while Dor Saar is short, she's quick, and smart and I thought she ran the offense fine. I just didn't think the team ran the sets well, again standing and waiting, no flow to it, a lack of effort. You can't play basketball with your heels on the floor, you have to be active. I though Saar looked good, and if she develops she'll be good. I liked what I saw out of Carroll, good positioning, played some D, rebounded well. She actually worked hard. I think Julie Brosseau looked like she's spent the offseason working out and is in great shape, she's going to show big improvements this year. Maddy Mcvicar looked solid, she finished in the paint and knocked down a jumper or two. I don't expect her to be the best player on the floor but I think she's going to be there to give a break (and side note she was pulling Saar aside to give advice which is great). Fanny Wadling looked like she is a vocal leader and is trying to assert control on the team.

No they didn't defend, no they didn't shoot well, no they didn't look like the effort was there, and it was clear this is not the same team as last year and not the same quality of freshman player.

But I think there are diamonds in the rough here.

Question : Did anyone else notice Richard Barron was in the arena, and walked out before the game ended?
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