Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby Maine19Fan » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:22 pm

Some opinions, none based on any real inside information. Call them "educated" assumptions, based on what traditionally happens during coaching searches.

Highly doubtful that Markwood will be hired by Maine if the job opens up. He makes more money as the associate head coach in a successful program than Maine would pay. He can use his current position as a stepping stone either to a better assistant's position in a Power 5 conference, or as a head coach at a mid-major program that will pay double what Maine pays.

Coaches in his position have to be careful. If he ever came to Maine and failed, odds are he''d never get another chance to be a head coach on the D1 level.

Hard to think someone on the current staff will replace a fired coach. That rarely happens.. Assistants are usually viewed as part of the problem, if you will. One might be held over as an assistant, based on the preference of a new head coach. But, it is extremely rare (and I can't think of any time it has happened) that an assistant coach from a staff replaces the fired head coach, unless it is not feasible in a timing sense to do otherwise... i.e., the situation at GW when Longergan in mid-September, 2016.

And, to correct basketball_buy's erroneous contention that Simon does not "write up the plan ..."
I think the reference is to game plans.
Every D1 program in the country uses its assistants to do the majority of the scouting/game planning. They usually trade off. Considering that Maine only has two full-time assistants, then Simon is doing the "scout" ... watching film and preparing game plans for every other game.
Or, was the reference to writing up the plan something else?

As far as recruiting goes, Simon was almost certainly involved in recruiting efforts, visits, etc., as soon as he got hired in September. Has Maine gotten any early signing period (mid November) commitments for next year? If they did, Simon had at least a little involvement.
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby Maine19Fan » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:45 pm

Hate to keep coming down on ol' 55, but consider all of these "gems:"

- That Simon is not from Maine is a "negative," because bringing in a Maine-bred coach would mean heavy recruitment of Maine players. In 55's view, 8-to-12 should be on the team at any time. Considering Maine's dearth of D1-level players in recent years, with no real prospects in the curreng h.s. ranks, that would doom the team to a steady diet of 4-25 seasons.

- "I hoped that Walsh would have listened to Simons." And, how does 55 know that he hasn't? He has absolutely no insight about that. 55 is even afraid to make a phone call to the Maine basketball office because he thinks they'd hang up on him!
So, in 55's mind, Simon operates in a vacuum. Walsh doesn't listen to him, which creates the wonder about whether Simon has been placed in solitary confinement and not allowed to even attend coaches' meetings.

- "Nothing has changed for 3 plus years, so '55 doesn't believe Simons has influenced Walsh at all.
But, Simons has only been on the staff for 14 weeks! The entire direction of a program doesn't change in 14 weeks, particularly when a new ass't coach gets hired so soon before preseason workouts begin.

- 55 rambles on about transfers, as if it's a malady that only affects Maine. As usual, no perspective. In recent years, more than 15% of men's basketball players at the D1 level transfer annually. That would mean, over any 4-year period, a program would lose up to 7 to 8 players.
The study doesn't break down what level suffers the most losses via transfers, but a guess is that a very low major program (like Maine) would lose a higher percentage of transfers due to players realizing they can play at a higher level. Sorry if that's a 55-like unsubstantiated assumption. Maybe that's not correct.

- 55 is incredulous that Ryan Bernstein was not awarded a scholarship after last season. Coach Walsh stated that he did not have one to offer. There are currently 13 scholarship players on the Maine roster, which is the maximum. So, the guess is that he found better players, that he didn't want to dedicate a scholarship to a player who very clearly wasn't going to have any real impact with the expectation that a scholarship would go to a better player.

Would giving Bernstein a scholarship have helped Maine?
You make the call: He transferred to Kent State ... where he remains a walk-on. He has played a grand total of 30 minutes this season, all at the end of blow-out games. He has scored one point.
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby bcbc55 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:00 am

Maine19Fan wrote:Hate to keep coming down on ol' 55, but consider all of these "gems:"

- That Simon is not from Maine is a "negative," because bringing in a Maine-bred coach would mean heavy recruitment of Maine players. In 55's view, 8-to-12 should be on the team at any time. Considering Maine's dearth of D1-level players in recent years, with no real prospects in the curreng h.s. ranks, that would doom the team to a steady diet of 4-25 seasons.

- "I hoped that Walsh would have listened to Simons." And, how does 55 know that he hasn't? He has absolutely no insight about that. 55 is even afraid to make a phone call to the Maine basketball office because he thinks they'd hang up on him!
So, in 55's mind, Simon operates in a vacuum. Walsh doesn't listen to him, which creates the wonder about whether Simon has been placed in solitary confinement and not allowed to even attend coaches' meetings.

- "Nothing has changed for 3 plus years, so '55 doesn't believe Simons has influenced Walsh at all.
But, Simons has only been on the staff for 14 weeks! The entire direction of a program doesn't change in 14 weeks, particularly when a new ass't coach gets hired so soon before preseason workouts begin.

- 55 rambles on about transfers, as if it's a malady that only affects Maine. As usual, no perspective. In recent years, more than 15% of men's basketball players at the D1 level transfer annually. That would mean, over any 4-year period, a program would lose up to 7 to 8 players.
The study doesn't break down what level suffers the most losses via transfers, but a guess is that a very low major program (like Maine) would lose a higher percentage of transfers due to players realizing they can play at a higher level. Sorry if that's a 55-like unsubstantiated assumption. Maybe that's not correct.

- 55 is incredulous that Ryan Bernstein was not awarded a scholarship after last season. Coach Walsh stated that he did not have one to offer. There are currently 13 scholarship players on the Maine roster, which is the maximum. So, the guess is that he found better players, that he didn't want to dedicate a scholarship to a player who very clearly wasn't going to have any real impact with the expectation that a scholarship would go to a better player.

Would giving Bernstein a scholarship have helped Maine?
You make the call: He transferred to Kent State ... where he remains a walk-on. He has played a grand total of 30 minutes this season, all at the end of blow-out games. He has scored one point.


19 Corrections:

1 I never, ever said 12 Maine kids 8 was the max 2 a year. what is the difference 4-25 or 3-27 and 6-25 and 1-11 right now

2. Nothing has changed offensively or defensively in 3 plus years and when watching games Simons is never involved with a conversation with Walsh.

3. When you bring in a qualified assistant like Simons after 3 years of 7-74 you would expect to see some changes if Walsh listened to Simons especially by now 3 months into another 1-11 season, I don't count those wins over non D-1 opponents.

4. I know that there are over 700 transfers a year in Men's D-1 basketball and that averages 2 a year per team not 5 and one half every two years like at UMaine

5. To me loyalty should be rewarded. Bernstein stepped into a very difficult position was playing 40 minutes some games and gave Walsh all he had, I guess loyalty and hard work doesn't seem to count much on Walsh's scorecard. Besides Bernstein was a better point guard then Arajuo is currently and a better scorer as a post guard too. Compare their stats for Bernstein and Arajuo at UMaine. And Arajuo is a JUCO juinor transfer and Bernstein was a true sophomore last year.

6. It was the right thing to do to give Bernstein a scholarship. I know Walsh uses a lot of players but Ashley gets more time then some of the scholarship players and he is a walkon.

The defense has rested it's case, it's time for the jury (you other MBR memebrs out their to give their individual verdict) did the prosecution or the defense is the winner in this case?
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby basketball_guy » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:38 am

First, I know Bob Simon. Ed Cooley knows Bob Simon and Cooley headed up Providence as Head Coach for a while.
If he feels Bob is ready for a Division 1 Coaching position and he commented in his article that Simon was primarily
responsible for recruiting the level of recruits at Providence then I believe him because Providence has been very
successful (ie gets to the NIT and NCAA tournaments year in and year out).

Second, Avery Johnson gave him credit for recruiting the current class of freshman at Alabama who's recruiting
class was rated 5th in the Nation two years ago which is the first year that Simon was able to actually bring in his
types of recruits because he told me so at our basketball alumni meeting. Why he left Alabama is anyones guess.
I don't think it was a smart move for Alabama, but that is because I wanted to see a few more players from the Northeast and midwest at Alabama, but Alabama two years ago had one those high school basketball classes that only comes along every 5 years or so so they chose to recruit regionally. There was a whole lot of basketball talent
two years ago in the State of Alabama.

Third, Simon was brought in at the last minute so there is no way he had any influence with this current crop of
recruits that have come in this year. He was hired in late September. No way does he have influence on the recruiting decisions that Walsh had already made. He might have had influence on potential walk ons this year
but that was about it. He is doing the best he can in a situation that can be difficult at best. Admittedly, he must
have seen the handwriting on the wall with Walsh, but so does Karlton Creech. He admitted as much at the end of the last debacle we call a basketball season up in Orono. I was pushing then for Walsh to be fired, but they
decided to keep him. I also said then I doubt he makes it to the end of December of 2017. I was wrong but not by much.

Fourth and finally, Simon is one of the most experienced Coaches Maine has ever had in Orono. It is doubtful he
came into this situation in discussions with Kreech that if Walsh did badly what would happen to him. I suspect
some sort of deal may have been worked out, but I am not privy to those conversations. Both parties wanted him
in the job for a good reason. To me that reason was to have some continuity in the program if Walsh was to be fired, he could step in.

But no way can Simon be even close to being blamed for the current situation. You have a Division 3 Coach attempting to Coach at a Division 1 level and it is definitely not working out. Walsh is making so many mistakes
recruiting, offensive plans, who goes in and goes out during the game. No way does Simon make those decisions.

No, I think Simon deserves a chance to be considered for the Head Coaching position. He can flat out recruit. If this was his team right now we would see some immediate changes just like he did for Providence and Alabama.
His track record speaks for itself. The other thing I know is when I told him I was from Maine while I was at the
Alabama basketball alumni meeting he was thrilled. He loves Maine. Spends a lot of time up here while he was in
Rhode Island. He does not want to go anywhere else. He loves the State of Maine believe me. But he needs a couple years to call this team his own. I say give the guy a chance.
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby Maine19Fan » Wed Dec 27, 2017 9:34 am

55, corrections:

1. Several of your previous posts (I'm not going to wade through your body of crapola to find them) advocated bringing in "2 to 3" Maine-based playeys every year. So, unless you're using arithmetic that is as outdated as your basketball views ... two annually equals 8 at any time, three annually equals 12 at any time.

2. Nothing has changed offensively or defensively? Could it possibly be that Walsh is employing offenses and defenses he believes best fits his personnel?

3. So, the only measurement of whether Walsh is listening to Simons is the amount of victories the current team has?
And, I ask again: How do you know if Walsh is, or is not, listening to Simons? Have you attended coaching meetings? Have you even made a call to ask about some of your unquantifiable theories? Oh, forgot ... you fear that if you called, that they'd hang up on you. Hard to believe, though, that Walsh would hang up on such a basketball mastermind as yourself (hope your sarcasm detector is working!).
I guess Simons is in solitary confinement, never allowed out of his own office, never allowed to even speak to Walsh right?

4. Two transfers per year on average equals 8 over a 4-year span. Some schools (Maine for one) has more, primarily because players perceive themselves to be better than this level and transfer up.

5. You might have "rewarded" loyalty at the high school level, but loyalty to a walk-on at the D1 level? In D1, it's a business. Coaches need to win to retain their jobs, to attract interest for the next move, to satisfy some wacko fans (like you) on message boards. Does loyalty mean giving a scholarship to an inconsequential (1 point so far this season at Kent State), non-contributing walk-on, or keeping it to give out to a more-talented player who might actually contribute to the primary goal of winning games?
This loyalty concept of yours as it pertains to a walk-on once again show how little you know about basketball above the high school level.

6. Oh, a scholarship to Bernstein was the "right thing" to do. Again, you're consistent with your lack of expertise about what happens in D1 basketball.

If this is your best at defending your case ... if you were defending someone on trial for murder, your client would be headed for the gas chamber!
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby Maine19Fan » Wed Dec 27, 2017 10:03 am

basketball_guy: Please refrain from comparing anything that happens at Maine to what you perceived happened at Alabama, where college sports is a different world, light years away from what happens at Maine.

OK, you wrote that "Cooley headed up Providence as Head Coach for a while ..." But, unless something happened yesterday ... Ed Cooley is still the head coach at Providence. Or, did your "Alabama connections" tell you otherwise?

Simon got hired in mid-September. Recruits don't sign letters of commitment before mid November. So, he was there for two months during an active recruiting period. Prospective players were visiting campus, accepting phone calls, etc. Simonds might not have been actually identifying the players that were being recruited, but you can be absolutely positive that he had a hand in the process, had direct contact with players being recruited, from mid-September to mid-November. Any player signed during the early period, if there was any, definitely had interactions with Simon.

I don't know anything about Simon, but ... if he's so great a coach, as you and 55 claim ... why did he leave Alabama, where his salary was at least triple what he's getting paid at Maine? Why would he leave such a relatively secure position to move to such a tenuous situation at Maine where he had to know the staff is going to be fired at the end of the season?
Maybe there's some underlying reason. Maybe there's some family related situation. Or, maybe, he just likes the Maine winters. I don't know. Just asking.

Oh, as I read the end of your post the reason became clear: It's because Simon "loves" Maine!
Sure, just like he loves having his salary cut from about $200K as an Alabama assistant to about $50K as a Maine assistant. Yeah, right.

As for "some deal" having been worked out in advance ...
It's the head coach's decision alone about who serves on his staff.
There is no way, 100 percent certainty, that Walsh would allow someone to come in who was promised to be the head coach when/if Walsh was fired.
If you KNOW something different, please pass along that information.
The great likelihood is that Simon is NOT going to be the next Maine head coach. Save this comment. Throw it back at me in April, if it happens. But, it won't.
Yet, you "suspect" this is what happened? Good stuff, based entirely on your fertile imagination. What else to you suspect? That aliens are being held in Area 51?

No one is blaming Simon for the state of Maine's program. Not 55, that's for sure. He thinks Simon is in solitary confinement, that Walsh doesn't allow Simon to offer input into anything. But, he's going to be viewed as part of the staff that finishes, say, 6-23 this season. Maybe, though ... if Walsh started listening to Simon the team would go on a 20-game winning streak!!!

And, how would you know that Walsh is making "so many mistakes"? Are you privy to the situations related to his decision making?
Mistakes in recruiting? How do you know anything about players he's recruiting? How do you know which players he's trying to bring here that won't come due to the variety of negative issues related to the school (location, location, location) and far better options for them elsewhere?

That's right, you don't know.
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby Maine19Fan » Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:38 am

After doing a little research ... here's why Coach Simon left Alabama for Maine:

He did not have his contract renewed at Alabama. Kind of surprised that our resident Alabama "expert" didn't know that.

No commentary here about whether or not he's a good assistant coach. He might be a great assistant coach, or he might be a lousy one. I don't know, and I doubt any of the individuals who post in this forum know, either.

But, hopefully, this information will dispel the perceptions that he was brought here specifically to be the next head coach.

He didn't come to Maine because he "loves Maine," or because there's some deal in place for him to replace Walsh.

He came to Maine because he wasn't renewed (he was fired) at Alabama, and he needed a job.
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby hoopsisme » Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:43 pm

If in fact a coaching change does happen, it will be interesting to see who is next. Chris Markwoods name will probably come up. No doubt making good coin down at Huntington Ave. He is from Maine as is his wife. Sometimes the lure of going from an asst to head coach is enough. As Bob knight would say the difference between an asst coach to head coach is suggestion vs decision. Only so many of those jobs open up each year. We shall see. Many games to go before that
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby Maine19Fan » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:14 pm

Markwood draws strong support in these forums, although that much of it comes from bcbc55 can't help.

There's also this: Why take a big-time cut in salary to become a head coach at a program which has been career suicide?
Anyone that comes in here and fails will never be considered for a head coaching position again.

I don't see the attraction, if I'm Markwood.
And, don't say it's loyalty, or that he's from Maine, or that he loves Maine.

This is a career. Money is important. So, too, is the concern for continuing to advance one's career.
Maine would offer Markwood any of that.
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Re: Next New Coach For UMaine Mens Basketball

Postby bcbc55 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:19 pm

Maine19Fan wrote:Markwood draws strong support in these forums, although that much of it comes from bcbc55 can't help.

There's also this: Why take a big-time cut in salary to become a head coach at a program which has been career suicide?
Anyone that comes in here and fails will never be considered for a head coaching position again.

I don't see the attraction, if I'm Markwood.
And, don't say it's loyalty, or that he's from Maine, or that he loves Maine.

This is a career. Money is important. So, too, is the concern for continuing to advance one's career.
Maine would offer Markwood any of that.


19: Money isn't everything to some people. Some people may have more values then you do 19. Maybe Markwood is that person. There is more to life than "money". But not in your mind, I know. But you don't know what Markwood thinks. Why did Markwood apply 4 years ago when Walsh was hired? He was probably making more money were he was as an associate head coach then he would have made as the head coach at Maine.
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