Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby mainah57 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:35 pm

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, notice I did not use "Happy Holidays", never have, never will


Yes, heaven forbid wishing a happy holiday season (regardless of what folks celebrate) to those around you.... :roll: :roll:

I know many folks with equal or greater basketball experience (or at a higher level) who would completely disagree with your philosophies... so does that make them more correct than you? I don't think you can simply say that the more experience someone has, the more "correct" their arguments are. There also needs to be a strong element of logic / savviness / willingness to look at more recent data points - without that, experience becomes moot.
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby bcbc55 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:45 pm

mainah57 wrote:
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, notice I did not use "Happy Holidays", never have, never will


Yes, heaven forbid wishing a happy holiday season (regardless of what folks celebrate) to those around you.... :roll: :roll:

I know many folks with equal or greater basketball experience (or at a higher level) who would completely disagree with your philosophies... so does that make them more correct than you? I don't think you can simply say that the more experience someone has, the more "correct" their arguments are. There also needs to be a strong element of logic / savviness / willingness to look at more recent data points - without that, experience becomes moot.


Mainah: My entire basketball philosophy and coaching for 29 years is/was based on the post season, the one and done season. Win or go home.

The pressure is really on the 3 point shooting in the one and done season, not like a regular season game of so what we will get them next time or next game as there is no next time if you lose. Pressure changes shooter's confidence especially if they donlt drop early in the one and done games.
The 3 point game becomes a detrement in the lose and go home season because to win a tournament you are going to have to probably suffer through at least one poor shooting game in 1 of 3 or more nights. What are you going to fall back on then?.

So I want to play all regular season long like how we are going to play in the tournament. What you have done in the regular season and 25cents won't get you a cup of tournament coffee come tourney time unless you are prepared to survive the bad shooting night, especially from beyond the arc.

"Live by the 3 (n the regular season no one and done game pressure) you may die by the three (in the one and done season because the game pressure is on here)".

Few remember what you did in the regular season, they only remember what you did in the one and done season in the last game you played of the year. Not many coaches coach this way, believe me, because history has shown that few can survive the bad shooting night of the friendly regular season 3's.
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby Maine19Fan » Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:28 pm

what Mainah57 said ...

Also, the 3 is the great equalizer.
It often enables lesser teams to beat better ones.
So why do you think "lesser" teams take more 3's than real good ones?
And, guess which category best fits the Maine men's team?

But, for you, 55, to claim after countless posts on this topic, that you're now only talking about post-season/one-and-done situations is to change the parameters of your entire previous posts in this debate.

Suddenly, though, you think it enhances your side of the argument by claiming you only meant to discuss the 3 in terms of tournament/one-and-done play.
That doesn't work. We know better!
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:42 am

Maine19Fan wrote:what Mainah57 said ...

Also, the 3 is the great equalizer.
It often enables lesser teams to beat better ones.
So why do you think "lesser" teams take more 3's than real good ones?
And, guess which category best fits the Maine men's team?

But, for you, 55, to claim after countless posts on this topic, that you're now only talking about post-season/one-and-done situations is to change the parameters of your entire previous posts in this debate.

Suddenly, though, you think it enhances your side of the argument by claiming you only meant to discuss the 3 in terms of tournament/one-and-done play.
That doesn't work. We know better!


Maine29Fan: Sorry, but that is the way I always coached. I coached in the regular season just like every game was a tournament game or one and done games. If you don't think so then you can ask any of my players who played for me all those 29 years or all the fans we upset during those years.

I never worried about getting to the tourney doing that because we made the tourney 26 of the 29 years I coached at 4 different schools and the 3 years we didn't make the tournament we finished 9th and if we had won our last game of each of those 3 seasons we would have made the tournament. So it was like a tourney game in those 3 situations. Our system was successful enough for us to be reaady and prepared for the tourney so we were prepared for the one and done season. We were interested in winning tournaments not regular season games as we knew that we would probably make the tourney preparing for the tournament. It is how you do in post season that really counts and we found preparing for it during the regular season was the best way to make the tourney and to be successful there and even to win some of those tournies.

I just didn't tell you that earlier because I didn't think it made any difference to you in the long run as you were more interested in telling me "the arm chair no nothing" what I didn't know about college coaching or the college game.

We were a ball control half-court team that was very patient on offense and a man to man straight half court defensive team on the ball tight driving ball to middle and all othr defenders had a foot in the paint. We also played some junk defenses diaind and one and triangle and two we needed too.

We never averaged below 50 points a game and many years we averaged 66 game and usually we averaged 45-60 points a game defensively.

We played not to beat ourselves. We played against ourselves and the game, not our opponents. We tried to shoot 70% from the line, commit no more that 12 turnovers and commit no more than 6 fouls per half to keep our opponents off the foul line.

Teams did not like to play us and they pressed us all regular season long which helped prepare us for the one an done season. Coached 16 years before the 3 came in during the 1987-88 season and never relied on the three those last 13 years We were a team that got the ball inside one way or another and feed off power layups. old fashioned 3's. We looked inside every pass and catch and only dribbled the ball once we started the half offense if we could not make a pass as then we could dribble penetrate because of the defensive over play denial defense as there was no help defense. If we were against a zone once we got up 8 and the ball we would hold it to force our opponents to man to man and then chop them up with the layup. and ball control for percentage shots.

Besides I went into coaching for one reason and one reason only, "To teach the life lessons that cannot be taught or learned in the academic high schools". This system was excellent for doing this and meeting that objective.

Our system was not very exciting, in fact it was boring, but it was very effective and taught the life lessons I wanted to teach. Sacrifice for the good of the whole, We before I, accepting and performing your role, making your teammates better, ability to think under pressure, how to handle pressure in hostile environments, how to overcome better talented people then yourselves, how to learn to cout on others and yourself. etc.

Basketball can do that and I had an average of more than 1 plus player go unto coaching for those 29 years. Also, ran same system when coaching middle school teams for 3 years and freshmen basketball for a year as I took a 10 year hiatus from high school coaching from 1977-87 when my children were coming up thru and coached them in middle school and as freshmen during that 10 year hiatus from high school coaching.

Coached at Fort Fairfield High School in 1961-62, Orono High School 1962-69, Bangor High School 1969-77 and then the 10 year hiatus from high school coaching (reffed and coached middle school 3 years and freshmen 1 year and then back to coaching to high school coaching at private secondary high school from 1987-2000 Coached the same way at all 4 high schools schools and at the middle school teams and freshmen team.

Anything else you would like to know about basketball and me over the past 73 years?????????????????????
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby Maine19Fan » Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:59 am

Here we go again, a long-winded, self-gratifying dissertation about 55's basketball life (by now, we've hard it all before ... too many times!) as he tries to backpedal from his early contention that he abhors the three-pointer. But, now, he only abhors it in one-and-done situations ... and, now, every game he ever coached in he perceived it as a one-and-done.

The story changes by the hour.

Geez, give it up!

I hope the life lessons you taught your players included moving into the modern era, leaving what worked in the past behind when it clearly doesn't work in the present.

This all is far, far more than anyone wants to know about you and your basketball connections over 73 years. In truth, we've heard it far, far too many times. There is NOTHING else we want to know about you!!!

This forum isn't about you. I don't think it was ever meant for posters to pump up their chests to tell us all how great they once were. I don't perceive basketball forums as a place for ego fulfillment. It's about discussing basketball issues. The message is what's important, not the messenger. The message is what's credible, not one's "73 years" in basketball. Please correct me if I'm wrong about any of that.

And, yes, your messages continue to reveal that despite your "73-year connection to basketball," you know very little about the game that's played at the college level.

You can't have a better today if you don't stop thinking about the past!

So, congrats on your past service to basketball. Have a better today.

Merry Christmas
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Dec 24, 2017 3:12 pm

[quote="Maine19Fan"]Here we go again, a long-winded, self-gratifying dissertation about 55's basketball life (by now, we've hard it all before ... too many times!) as he tries to backpedal from his early contention that he abhors the three-pointer. But, now, he only abhors it in one-and-done situations ... and, now, every game he ever coached in he perceived it as a one-and-done.

The story changes by the hour.

Geez, give it up!

I hope the life lessons you taught your players included moving into the modern era, leaving what worked in the past behind when it clearly doesn't work in the present.

This all is far, far more than anyone wants to know about you and your basketball connections over 73 years. In truth, we've heard it far, far too many times. There is NOTHING else we want to know about you!!!

This forum isn't about you. I don't think it was ever meant for posters to pump up their chests to tell us all how great they once were. I don't perceive basketball forums as a place for ego fulfillment. It's about discussing basketball issues. The message is what's important, not the messenger. The message is what's credible, not one's "73 years" in basketball. Please correct me if I'm wrong about any of that.

And, yes, your messages continue to reveal that despite your "73-year connection to basketball," you know very little about the game that's played at the college level.

You can't have a better today if you don't stop thinking about the past!

So, congrats on your past service to basketball. Have a better today.

19: Used the same one and done philosophy of coaching FOR ALL GAMES REGULAR SEASON OR ONE AND DONE TOURNAMENT GAMES. NOTHING CHANGED.

Abhor the overuse and abuse of the 3 for all games. If coaches at any level want to "live by the three (in the regular season) and die by the three (in the one and done season)" I could care less. Just root for the team that uses the 3 the least of the 2 teams playing at any level in a game.

Merry Christmas
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby Maine19Fan » Mon Dec 25, 2017 9:07 am

55: EVERY coach uses a one-and-done philosophy in EVERY game they coach.
You weren't exactly an innovator in that regard.
Did you think coaches operate with schemes that wouldn't ensure the best chance of success?
That involves taking the best shots available. If those happen to be 3-point shots, so be it.
Once again I'll bring this to your attention: Analytics ... statistical evidence/facts ... have proven that the wide-open 3-point shot is the second-best shot that can be taken, right behind the dunk.
Again, come into the modern world.

Anyway, I think if we ever met we'd have a lively discussion about basketball. We'd probably enjoy it.
We're both very obviously passionate about our favorite sport.
Maybe some day we'll arrange to sit down over a few cups of coffee.
We could probably charge admission!

For now, though, I sincerely hope that you're having a very Merry Christmas with your loved ones. That's what this day is all about, not some very petty debates about basketball philosophies. Don't get hurt shoveling all the snow we're getting!
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby bcbc55 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 3:37 pm

Maine19Fan wrote:55: EVERY coach uses a one-and-done philosophy in EVERY game they coach.
You weren't exactly an innovator in that regard.
Did you think coaches operate with schemes that wouldn't ensure the best chance of success?
That involves taking the best shots available. If those happen to be 3-point shots, so be it.
Once again I'll bring this to your attention: Analytics ... statistical evidence/facts ... have proven that the wide-open 3-point shot is the second-best shot that can be taken, right behind the dunk.
Again, come into the modern world.

Anyway, I think if we ever met we'd have a lively discussion about basketball. We'd probably enjoy it.
We're both very obviously passionate about our favorite sport.
Maybe some day we'll arrange to sit down over a few cups of coffee.
We could probably charge admission!

For now, though, I sincerely hope that you're having a very Merry Christmas with your loved ones. That's what this day is all about, not some very petty debates about basketball philosophies. Don't get hurt shoveling all the snow we're getting!


19: Certainly agree with your last two paragraphs of 7 lines by 100%. We just have to agree to disagree.

Oh, at my age I have a plow on my truck, don't do much shoveling. Thanks for the concern and warning though.
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby Maine19Fan » Mon Dec 25, 2017 3:41 pm

Honestly, bcbc55, I can't see how you wouldn't agree with my entire previous post.

Except for the fact that you're a from-another-era contrarian.

How can you not agree that an open 3-pointer is a great shot, particularly when analytics (facts!) show it's the second-best shot a team can take, next to a dunk?

How can you not agree that every coach treats every game as a must-win/one-and-done?
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Re: Maine19Fan: Your real name and bb experience please.

Postby bcbc55 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:45 pm

Maine19Fan wrote:Honestly, bcbc55, I can't see how you wouldn't agree with my entire previous post.

Except for the fact that you're a from-another-era contrarian.

How can you not agree that an open 3-pointer is a great shot, particularly when analytics (facts!) show it's the second-best shot a team can take, next to a dunk?

How can you not agree that every coach treats every game as a must-win/one-and-done?


19: oversite on my part. 3 is a very high percentage shot if the shooter is a good 3 point shooter. However, not all players are good 2 poin t shootrs. But most basketball player can shoot a power layup.

Let me ask you, If your life depended on making a shot unguarded (make it you live and miss it you die..(like living gby and dying by the three) and you had your choice of shots would you take a 1. dunk. 2. Power Layup or 3. a 3.

Not all coaches treat the regular season games as one and done games because many do not have anything to go to if they are having a bad shooting game from beyond the arc. To win a tourney you have to be prepared to have one bad shooting night. Many coaches I coached against did not and when I officiated I saw many that didn't either. Also, when doing radio/TV tournament color commentating I saw teams shoot themselves right out of one and done games because that is all they had. "They lived by the three and died by the three".

If we got down b y 10-12 points in game in the second half we would go 1-3-1 zone and many teams would shoot us right back into the game by taking 3's trying to run up the score.
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