WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby mainejeff » Sun Mar 12, 2017 11:43 am

MaineMike wrote:What is the TJC?

I love Maine sports. Is it in any way offensive to present counter points, to point out that, on Saturday, Albany was the superior team in its game with Maine?

Seems that those contentions are fair game, particularly since there seems to be so much hatred/animosity for the men's coach and his program. It looks like MJ is the prime perpetrator in his hatred for coach Walsh.


Welcome back Mainebballer! ;)
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby zonid » Sun Mar 12, 2017 11:43 am

He registered here after his other username, mainebballer was banned. He is still posting under the mainebballer name on the basketballboards.net forum and coincidentally is talking up Will Brown, posting a bunch of facts regarding his tenure at Albany. Clearly an Albany fan.

Regarding this being the only forum, not necessarily true but a lot of good posters are fighting the good fight here. I find it tiresome.
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby mainejeff » Sun Mar 12, 2017 12:00 pm

zonid wrote:He registered here after his other username, mainebballer was banned. He is still posting under the mainebballer name on the basketballboards.net forum and coincidentally is talking up Will Brown, posting a bunch of facts regarding his tenure at Albany. Clearly an Albany fan.

Regarding this being the only forum, not necessarily true but a lot of good posters are fighting the good fight here. I find it tiresome.


Unfortunately the board has devolved into a "look at me' forum. Nothing can be discussed anymore with out it turning into a tirade of personal insults....much like our current political climate. Black Bear fans know what the school's shortcomings are....many of us have been fans for years if not decades. The constant negative beat of the drum on location, weather, etc is just plain tired & boring....it's nothing new and every coach in every sport has had to deal with it. UM has much better facilities and academics now....2 things that can be controlled (location and weather can't). So with all that in mind...coaches can and should be held accountable. They should receive accolades when they win (Barron, Coach H, Coutts, Babineau) and they should be called out when they don't (Gendron, Walsh, Trimper)

Coaches at UM get quite a long leash when it comes to winning. They are allowed to stay on for much longer than most schools would allow them to which is understandable to some extent. But there also comes a time when underachieving becomes a norm and program improvement seems to be put on the back burner. That is when it is time for a change. Walsh will get one more season which is reasonable under the fiscal & injury circumstances. If the program does not show improvement on and off the court....he will be fired. It's that simple.
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby MaineBBFan99 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 1:44 pm

Albany was clearly the better team on Friday afternoon and dominated Maine in nearly every facet of the game. Forcing Maine into 24 turnovers, springing Tate free for her patented mid-range jumper on several occasions, and receiving an enormous contribution from freshman MacKenzie Trpcic (17 points; averaged just over 4 ppg in conference play coming into Friday's game) were key factors in Albany's dominance in quarters 2-4.

Given how Maine played at the CIC this season, I don't think one can say with any certainty what would have happened if Maine had hosted this game. That having been said, Albany earned the right to host the championship game with its conference regular season record.

Echoing Mr Neal's comments, how do you not have a functioning scoreboard (and, later in the game, a functioning shot clock) for a conference championship game? Now, obviously, this issue played no role in Maine's loss, but it is pretty embarrassing, to say the least. Can you imagine the reaction if this game actually came down to the final possession, and the shot clock continued to malfunction?

Lastly, I just want to say what a pleasure it has been to watch Sigi Koizar play over the past four years. She has earned her spot as one of the greatest basketball players ever to put on a Black Bears uniform. Courtesy of Don Shields' twitter account, just look at her career stats: https://twitter.com/DonShieldsMaine. Sure, it was disappointing to see someone so deserving never win the conference championship. However, she played a significant role in this program's back-to-back conference regular season titles and back-to-back conference championship game appearances. Given where the program was four years ago, that's not too shabby. She epitomized what it means to be a student-athlete - a 3.97 GPA as a bio/pre-med major and countless academic accolades. Most importantly, she accomplished all of these feats with a level of grace and humility that was both refreshing and inspirational. What an ambassador for women's basketball and what a role model for aspiring student-athletes!
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby TAL1957 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 3:21 pm

Thank-you, Thank-you, ... THANK-YOU.
turkeyman wrote:Tournament observations.

Maine, as a four seed, had a far tougher path to the title than Albany had as a two. No surprise there. Maine's opponents averaged a 2.67 seed (5 + 1 + 2, divided by 3) while Albany's averaged 5.67 (7 + 6 + 4 divided by 3). That's a huge difference. Maine played two teams above its seed, Albany none. Albany got gigantic boosts when Hartford (6) upset UMBC (3) and Maine upset UNH (1). UMBC had beaten Albany twice during the regular season. This is not an excuse. Albany did what it had to do.

Albany got another break in the Hartford game when the referees lost control of the game, which happened roughly at the tipoff. Not that the referees gave Albany the game, but in losing control, they gave Albany's physical style an advantage. Hartford's short bench meant Albany could pound the Hawks at will all day, and the Hartford players just had to take it. No one on the bench to spell them. Still, Albany only won by two and even then a buzzer beater could have won it for Hartford.

Hartford upset UMBC and stayed in the Albany game because Darby Lee hit her first 12 shots (7/7 against UMBC) in the two games and because of the gutsy leadership of Deanna Mayza at point. Mayza richly deserved the all-tourney team (Tate, Trpcic, Mayza, Sigi, Blanca). She played all year with an injured meniscus. Her coach regularly spelled her, almost regardless of the game situation, and she delivered big time. Time after time, Mayza found the open man, put up her own shots and harassed Albany ball handlers. It was quite a performance. The head-to-head of two top points (McCarley vs. Mayza) in the first round went game, set, match to Mayza.

How long since the top seed played two games and placed no one on the all-tourney team? UNH managed it this year. In 2005, Maine had the one seed and no one made all-tourney, but Maine only played one game, being upset in the first round by BU (the one in Boston).

The Albany team that Maine played in February and March was not the Albany team Maine had beaten in January. Tate had just come back from injury in January -- still she dropped 32 that day -- and the team had struggled to fit the pieces together after the coach, the star (Richards, graduated) and the solid, quiet leader (Zakiya Saunders) all left. Tate scored at will that day, but the rest of the team pretty much just watched as Blanca and Tanesha put on a show. By February, Albany had gelled, and the mighty mite McKenzie Trpcic had come into her own. Albany may have been the best team in the conference by the beginning of February. If Saunders had stayed in Albany rather than following the coach to Orlando for her final year of eligibility, Albany might have dominated the conference from the get-go.

Only a Game, the Public Radio sports show, had a great feature this morning on America East (men's side). Good thing, too, since the conference covered itself in doo-doo on the women's side. How do you play a championship game on national television without a scoreboard??? Come on, guys, does anyone here know how to do this? Much of the 30 minutes up to the tipoff, with the scoreboard dark, a knot of men stood around the scorers table talking and shaking their heads. Didn't see anyone following cords to check connections, etc., but I trust someone did. By the fourth quarter, even the shot clocks had gone out. And, the conference had no programs printed for the six games in Portland. Fortunately, the Press Herald had put together a 16-page tabloid with all the lineups, and it was free. At Albany yesterday, an hour before the game, someone showed up with one small box of programs with lineups and write-ups for all eight teams. And it cost $3. At halftime, it looked like barely half had sold. At 5:00 of the fourth, during a dead ball, the ESPN guy stood up and called a media time out. The official Mark Resch looked like he was refusing to call it, but the commercials may have already been rolling out in TV land. Resch came over to the scorers table and the crowd could hear him barking at the ESPN guy: "It's the first dead ball inside five minutes. That's the rule." TV watchers missed this exchange, but those of us in the hall saw it loud and clear. I doubt the boost from the Public Radio program made up for the screw-ups of the lack of scoreboard and the lack of programs or the confusion over forced timeouts. How much does AE pay the commissioner to make sure everything works?

Portland's smallest crowd was a hair fewer than 1,000 for two games that had no local (Maine, UNH) teams. Albany yesterday drew 1,231 for the championship. So, Albany turned out 300 more people for a championship game in a metro area that is almost as populous as the entire state of Maine (1.2 million Albany, 1.3 million Maine) and whose home team is defending its title. Jeesh. Bingo's largest crowd last year was 900 for two games that involved all three New York teams (Albany vs. Bingo, Maine vs. Stony Brook). The commissioner did speak well of the support AE got in Portland. Not sure she knew how to get herself there, but at her level, you can always hire a driver. Or take the Concord bus.

Albany deserved to win. It was the better team against Vermont and Maine, and it capitalized on the situation against Hartford. The home court, even with three-quarters of the seats empty, was an advantage in the final. I wonder whether in the old days (before ESPN began calling the shots) of the three-day, single-site tournament Maine's emotional charge from the UNH game might have carried over into an Albany game the next day. As it was, the team had to return to an empty campus, then three days later ride out to Albany. It may be tougher to re-create an emotional high than to maintain it. Albany, on the other hand, left Portland with a sigh of relief for having escaped an ambush, and could work on building momentum for just one game. As Geno Auriemma says, the key to winning a tournament is to win the game you play badly, and every team plays one game badly in a tournament. In a three-day tournament, Maine, with its long bench, might have had a bit of an advantage.

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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby turkeyman » Sun Mar 12, 2017 4:09 pm

Mainemike,

Thanks for responding. Four points.

First, Albany is a government, college and banking town. Friday afternoon is seldom heavy office time in those occupations. Ever tour a government office or a university faculty building on a Friday afternoon? I have. In addition, UAlbany has more than 1,200 faculty (according to the UAlbany website). At most universities, the staff is one to two times the size of the faculty, so perhaps 2,400 to 3,600 UAlbany employees could have walked across campus to the game. Besides, the vast majority of fans for wbb in any college arena I've been in, which is more than 50 from Bangor to Gainesville, Fla., to Kansas City to Green Bay, is people who challenge me in age -- I'm 76 -- and most of us are done punching time clocks.

Second, the population figure came from Wikipedia, which cited two sources, one of which was a Google factbook. It was 1,170,483 for metro Albany, which I rounded up to 1.2 million. You are correct that the federal census figure is lower, at 881,830, a difference of 288,653. The total attendance, if you figure about 50 in the crowd were from Maine, was .0013 percent, or less than one-seventh of one percent of the population of metro Albany, using census numbers. Hard to imagine they couldn't scare up more than 1,231 out of 881,830. There were probably more people panhandling on the streets of Albany that afternoon.

The Binghamton metro area is two-sevenths the population of metro Albany, according to the census. If Bingo turned out fans in the same proportion as Albany, Bingo's attendance would have been 351 in the final game of the 2016 tournament. It didn't, it turned out more than 900 for that second-round session, or nearly three times the proportion of metro population that Albany turned out. And it wasn't a championship game.

If you are in or familiar with Maine, you likely know that the first day of the AE tournament in Portland was competing with eight high-school state games, and two more were held the night before. In fact, I attended one in Augusta, then went to Portland for AE on Saturday and Sunday. And, Bowdoin, Husson, UNE and St. Joe's were all playing in the D III NCAA tournament on Friday, March 3, out of state, so a few folks who might have gone to Portland were following their favorite D III teams elsewhere. Portland had quite a bit of high-school competition and still turned out nearly 3,000 people for two AE session on March 4. Truth of the matter is that despite the outstanding athletic programs it has developed since going D I, UAlbany hasn't drawn folks to wbb. I don't know how its other sports draw. The basketball arena, as I have posted here in the past, is a building only a bureaucrat could love. Stony Brook is in the same SUNY system as UAlbany but has a beautiful building, a close rival to the Cross Insurance Center.

Third, I never wrote that more fouls were called on Maine than on UAlbany. I wrote that Albany's physical style in its game against Hartford benefited from very poor officials who lost control of the game early on. I made no mention of the rough nature of Albany's game against Maine. But that style does work better when the officials back off.

Fourth, I wrote that Albany did what it had to do to win the championship. There was no doubt who had the better team on the floor that day. But the facts show that one time in three this year, Maine beat Albany. I would never write that Albany wins that game no matter where it is played. If that were the case, why not save all of us some trouble and just give the title to Albany? That is, as they say, why we play the games.

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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby bcbc55 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 4:59 pm

Bob: You have the patience of JOB: To do the research you do to make such an informative, factual and interesting post is far beyond my patience and I am only 3 years well almost 4 years older than you, when I hit the big EIGHTOH.

I agree had that game with Albany had been played Monday night at the Cross Insurance Arena in Portland following Maine's upset win over UNH or had it been played the same Friday, March 10 at the Cross Center in Bangor where without a doubt they would have drawn over 3000 fan and 99.9% of them Maine fans the result might have been different.

As you are so well aware Maine plays very well as a young team this year at the CIC as this seasons home record indicates.

Just wasn't in the cards for Sigi, the freshmen and Sutton.

However, they met my expectations as I thought after seeing them several times in the non-conference games that they were potentially good enough to do as well as Sigi and the 8 seniors.......AND THEY DID.

Again, thank you for your year long posts keeping us basketball fanatics updated and informed about many things that we are usually not aware of or about the women's basketball program.

From a scale of 9 to 10 with ten being the highest, your posts this season were a nine............................teen!
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby Tom Nolette » Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:31 am

zonid wrote:And here is the next troll to ruin this board. I expect Tom will do nothing.

Coming here is a chore at this point. I'm done. The quicker Maine fans realize this is a board to discuss UMaine sports on a site permeated by non-UMaine fans and NOT a UMaine fan board the better. I'm done. Best of luck in this den of vipers.


if you contact me when a new troll shows up, we can address . ... instead, you complain, entertain trolls, whine and complain .. I say many of you like the chaos as that's what you respond too.

I am perfectly happy just posting information and allowing for fewer posters .. I provide these forums for fun not for abuse .. so get on board or leave .. I could care if you or anyone else stops posting ..
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby wmtwsportsprod » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:20 pm

for what its worth, Albany got 16 seed and plays at UConn......so if Maine had won there was no way they were getting higher then 16 seed....Conference RPI is great stat to go buy but I dont think its always viewed as highly in womens field as it might be in the mens....with the first two rounds on campus, a lot of times they just do what is easy
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Re: WBB: AE Championship Final vs Albany 3/10 4:30 PM

Postby parquetfloor » Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:28 pm

wmtwsportsprod wrote:for what its worth, Albany got 16 seed and plays at UConn......so if Maine had won there was no way they were getting higher then 16 seed....Conference RPI is great stat to go buy but I dont think its always viewed as highly in womens field as it might be in the mens....with the first two rounds on campus, a lot of times they just do what is easy


The conference RPI is #22. It's not like that is really good. It's a 1-bid league. Maybe UNH would have gotten a 15 but there was no way anybody was getting a high seed. Albany has an RPI of 113 with only 1 top 100 win (UNH #76). 6 losses to teams outside the top 100, including 4 against teams with an RPI lower than 200! It wasn't a matter of "easy".
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